For hourly people its the law. If on salary they can work you 24/7 for
the same amount as straight time.
I had a salary job once, for 15 years. Many was the week I put in 50-60 hours and maybe given an extra $10 in cash at the end of the week.

'
That's downright insulting! I'd give my 14-minute notice: "You'll notice in about two weeks that I've been gone two weeks; that's your two weeks notice."

and the hours on a calendar. (Being old-fashioned I prefer real paper

Same; except now I make a notepad file for each day, that I use for notes during my shift, & I save it with the number of hours I did & how many are full-pay hours (if on-call, I get minimum wage for those hours; if the phone rings & I'm needed, I get my full, professional wage level; for those hours!

I have final determination of which hours are which, as I submit an invoice with an honest reckoning every two weeks, to our accountant.

No micromanagement was just how I liked to work; give me the overview of what's needed & how you normally do things, then set me loose on it. . .

I provide reports of anything of note that are rightful for the owner to know, &/or could be used for training purposes. Keeping my boss updated is my role everywhere. They fdresserveto know where their money is going.

Same as when I get an itemized statement from a hospital or doctor before I pay them.

Have caught several people trying to scam non-covered procedures. I document all the facts & I let the insurance's doctor know, then I do as directed (that's where the money my boss pays me comes from; so yes, sir; no, sir, & my day is good. My cheques clear the bank every fortnight, so I'm a happy camper!

In security we had to keep a daily activity log (DAR), we called "a
daily".
One was filled out each shift with start/stop time, and an hourly report
of what was going on. Mostly its just something like:
0800 - Arrived on post, relived so-and-so (if one to relieve), made inspection round. All appears secure. Monitoring lobby (or whatever we were there to do).
0900- Monitoring lobby
This went on for the entire day and at the end:
1600 Relieved by so-and-so, off post.
Anything out of the ordinary was recorded such as alarms and what was
done, suspicious person/event and how handled, etc.

Oy! Annoying; can you put in blocks of time, & just itemize individual events within the right one?

Except in parking we had no designated lunch time and ate on post and not recorded since we were at our desk, podium, whatever, when we ate. So our

The law here is we must have 30 minutes(unpaid) time in an 8-hour shift, away from our workspace & with no responsibilities (i.e. can't be on call for the time, like my job required on night shifts when it was only me. I could've demanded someone be assigned to relieve me at 02h00; I was happy to ensure my 30 minutes was paid in full, ad if I hads no lunch.

I'm not here(life) to cause problems.

I had a supervisor who wanted to know where I was and what I was doing
every minute, literally.
I spent more time recording this than working.

Ai chihuahua -- that's annoying! But assigned bosses are still bosses, eh?

I tend to be literal in everything with this type, so they figure out, quicker, that it's a dumb way to operate -- let me have freedom to at & I'll take care of business (twice I was in a position where the entire company was on my shoulders for 4 or more hours straight! Naturally I acquitted myself well & cemented my importance to the company. Only one other could've done it & no way she would've without a financial reward specific to the occasion (Not me -- I'm on the clock, I don't care much what I'm doing. While others are still training for one position, in 8-12 weeks, I'm prepared to be put anywhere in the company
& do the job right, with no notice.)

My daily would read something like:
0800 Arrived on post, got radio and writer.
0810 Got golf cart and began patrol and ticketing.
0813 Tickets D Lot.
0816 Ticketed B lot..
And this went on all blessed day long.

Couldn't you let your ticket book do the talking for when you write tickets?

Did you have quota encouragements or demands?

Here the courts have ruled that tickets given by private parking spaces are not valid. Of course, they have the right to refuse entry, but they cannot dun for payment. I always advise people to meet the manager & negotiate a compromise payment to close the file & open up their lots again to them.

This was one thing that really irked me.
Everyone was given a raise to $10 an hour a year or so ago. But my raise went up only 50 cents to $10.50 an hour.
I was upset since with the raise I was making only 50 cents more an hour
than a new hire right off the street with 15 years experience and being a lieutenant. I had been making $1.50 an hour more than the others. I felt my pay should have gone up that muc

Yup, it belittles your experience & added value. One charity organisation I'm on the board of, had to increase our pay to those getting minimum wage (most non-managers) so we increased it for the managers as well, for the reasons you cite there -- we don't need to be belittling our people we rely on, who've been with us a long time & work well. Luckily we got our main funding source to raise their yearly grant to us to include the higher payroll costs, plus a COL indexing yearly for all paid staff.

I enthusiastically supported this whole approach, as I'm all about fairness.

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
* Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)

CP wrote --

That's downright insulting! I'd give my 14-minute notice: "You'll notice in about two weeks that I've been gone two weeks; that's your two weeks notice."

In November 1993 I had finally had enough (lots of other work related
issues that piled one on top of another) and I finally had enough and just
quit and walked off.
On the way home I thought "What have I done? Maybe if I go back..." but thought no, let the boss come to me. He never did.
I have run into him off and on over the years and we get along, no hard feelings.

No micromanagement was just how I liked to work; give me the overview of what's needed & how you normally do things, then set me loose on it. .

That's the way I am, or was.
I'll spend the first couple of days going over the basics, once that is learned I give more detailed information and turn them loose a bit by bit
then go over their work to make sure they knew what they were doing.
At the end of each day, or the start of the next, I would go over what
they had done, any questions (I was always available to answer any), etc.
And each morning would go over anything they needed to know such a a
special event, etc. After they were there for a while this was usually just a heads up note.
After about two weeks or so they should know the basics, make their own decisions and be "on their own". After a while they could figure out how
best to cover their territory and what worked best for them.
I am firm believer in teaching what a person needs to know, then get out
of their way. Parking was not a life or death or national security issue
and people learn from their mistakes. Even after 15 years there I would still goof up from time to time.

I provide reports of anything of note that are rightful for the owner to know, &/or could be used for training purposes. Keeping my boss updated is my role everywhere. They fdresserveto know where their money is going.

That is part of why a Daily Activity Report (DAR) was kept by the hour. Plus there were legal reasons in case the client would ever ask what we were doing.
Things like "monitoring lobby" was a catch all for a lot of things. In addition to keeping an eye on who came and went, it was also answering any questions, greeting people, idle chit chat, etc.
There were few places we kept a record of who came and went and the
times. Generally it was if the building was closed and they had an access key/card they came and went as they pleased.
Some places we patrolled the building perimeter which I liked since able
to get away from the desk and go for a walk. Also a time to check for
anything unusual. I joked that I walked around the building "to make sure all the doors and windows were still
Another catch all was "traffic control". That would be keeping off a lot they don't belong on, making sure traffic moves smoothly (park, unload/load, and move), answering questions, etc.
I enjoyed working traffic control for large twice yearly career fairs.
The vendors appreciated being able to unload whatever, being told where
to park, etc. I was there till either the last vendor arrived or 15 minutes after the start of the event.
Then I would go to the room and wander around the tables and get all
sorts of freebies they were handing out.
Pens were a big deal. I would get only one from each table. Then I
took those to the office and my civilian boss got first pick, then her assistant then the receptionist and my guys got the left overs. That is unless I
saw a pen I really like and I pock
One time the Army had nice looking black and gold pens, that matched my uniform. Used that one for a long time.
Oh, we had this one fella from the WV State Police who would park
causing problems. I had to wait till everyone was there since if I left before hand it caused more problems.
Many was the time I had to have him move his car out of the way.
One time I was walking toward his table and a regular said "Looks like so-and-so is in trouble again" as I passed by.
The trooper asked, "I guess you want me to move?" I said yes sir and he
did. Ah, the power! Telling a state trooper to move. :)
One year a table had USB plugs and got one. The following event there
were more tables with them. I eventually got about 10 of them, that I still use.
The vendors were glad to get rid of whatever since it made less to take back. And it was a thank you for being helpful. Take one, take one was
often said to me at different tables with different things.
And candy was popular as well and usually had a stockpile for weeks.

Oy! Annoying; can you put in blocks of time, & just itemize individual events within the right one?

See above re: legality.
In addition these hourly reports would show the time was amiss was
discovered and how it was covered and the eventual outcome/result.

The law here is we must have 30 minutes(unpaid) time in an 8-hour shift, away from our workspace & with no responsibilities

If working a non-lunch shift (having to remain on post) we took our lunch when we wanted and were paid for it.
In parking we got a 30 minute lunch, unpaid, whether we took it or not.
If something happened we couldn't take a lunch, or had to work a little
over for some reason, we merely added that extra time to our lunches later
on.
We got no pay for over time in parking. It was a straight 37.5 hours a
week.
If for some reason we didn't take a lunch we merely added that time to
lunch over the following days.
One time there was a power line down and had to secure an area until the electric company could repair the line and re-open the area. That was a 10 hour day, which gave me a three hours (all total) lunch which I took in
30-45 minute increments over a few
If something like that happened on a 8 or 12 hour (straight time) shift
that to over time was added to the days time and paid for that.
The reason was added to the time sheet and recorded on the daily.

on the clock, I don't care much what I'm doing. While others are still training for one position, in 8-12 weeks, I'm prepared to be put anywhere in the company & do the job right, with no notice.)

People should be trained for anything that might come up, or at least
have a book on how to handle something.

Couldn't you let your ticket book do the talking for when you write tickets?

When I finished my DAR in parking I would write "ticket total X" on each
one. From that and the daily report the company could see what I had been doing.
There were times there were simply patrol days on campus for any number
of reasons (some special event, a lot of guests, etc). Patrol days we
ticketed only for fire lanes, handicap and no parking zones. On a average day I
might write 190 tickets, on a pat

Here the courts have ruled that tickets given by private parking spaces are not valid.

At Marshall all spaces were public.
There was no private or reserved spaces. The "reserved" spaces were for
the president and few others big shots. But even then the president didn't have one space, just whichever space was available in that area. But being creatures of habit, they were us

I enthusiastically supported this whole approach, as I'm all about fairness.

Yep. Gonna do it for one its done for all or its not done at all.
Joe
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No micromanagement was just how I liked to work; give me the overview of

what's needed & how you normally do things, then set me loose on it. .

That's the way I am, or was.
I'll spend the first couple of days going over the basics, once that is learned I give more detailed information and turn them loose a bit by bit then go over their work to make sure they knew what they were doing.
At the end of each day, or the start of the next, I would go over what
they had done, any questions (I was always available to answer any), etc.
And each morning would go over anything they needed to know such a a
special event, etc. After they were there for a while this was usually just a
heads up note.
After about two weeks or so they should know the basics, make their own decisions and be "on their own". After a while they could figure out how best to cover their territory and what worked best for them.
I am firm believer in teaching what a person needs to know, then get out
of their way. Parking was not a life or death or national security issue
and people learn from their mistakes. Even after 15 years there I would still
goof up from time to time.

The way I see it -- if you hired the guy, presumably you have vetted him/her for the job already, & no need to keep close tabs on them (unless you were forced to hire the owner's nephew, then what would you gain by catching them in failures anyway?)

I provide reports of anything of note that are rightful for the owner to >know, &/or could be used for training purposes. Keeping my boss updated is my

role everywhere. They fdresserveto know where their money is going.
That is part of why a Daily Activity Report (DAR) was kept by the hour.
Plus there were legal reasons in case the client would ever ask what we were doing.

Of course; respect & common sense "CYA" self-preservation.

Things like "monitoring lobby" was a catch all for a lot of things. In addition to keeping an eye on who came and went, it was also answering any questions, greeting people, idle chit chat, etc.
There were few places we kept a record of who came and went and the
times. Generally it was if the building was closed and they had an access key/card they came and went as they pleased.

Of course, with an access card their comings & goings can be easily logged digitally & most would be aware of this, providing the same level of deterrence as a human attendant, but cheaper.

I enjoyed working traffic control for large twice yearly career fairs.
The vendors appreciated being able to unload whatever, being told where
to park, etc. I was there till either the last vendor arrived or 15 minutes after the start of the event.
Then I would go to the room and wander around the tables and get all
sorts of freebies they were handing out.

I love 'swag' at Expos & suchlike events. At one I go to regularly -- a Small Business Expo, they usually have tote bags at the greeting table, to hold your loot you get from inside. I fill with brochures of interest, pens, highlighters, candy, et al.

Pens were a big deal. I would get only one from each table. Then I

All my pens are obtained this way now.

The trooper asked, "I guess you want me to move?" I said yes sir and he
did. Ah, the power! Telling a state trooper to move. :)

Chalk a point up for the civilian, eh?.

One year a table had USB plugs and got one. The following event there
were more tables with them. I eventually got about 10 of them, that I still use.

plugs? Flash-drives? Under 1Gb each?

The vendors were glad to get rid of whatever since it made less to take
back. And it was a thank you for being helpful. Take one, take one was often said to me at different tables with different things.

This is how it is at flea market/bazaar type sales -- I ensure to do a go-round

an hour before closing, to get steals -- I could've had a ginormous 600lb line printer for $10(asking price was $200), if I'd had away to get it home & anywhere to put it.

If working a non-lunch shift (having to remain on post) we took our lunch when we wanted and were paid for it.

Normally how I prefer to work. My f9irst adult job was in fast food & we could take our breaks whenever it didn't interfere with serving customers & were subject to recall on the floor by a coworker if needed.

I was a smoker, so took 5 minute smoke breaks whenever, even when working alone(instead of 4 people being on), but this never slowed down serving customers, & my boss knew it, so I did as I pleased, & got paid for the full 12 hour shifts. (opening to closing 6 days a week)

Once I met some girls & missed an entire day, showing up just before closing the next day -- my boss worked it all, but told me to cash out the register & that I'd be getting paid in full for both days. Which told me all I needed to know about whether he noticed what I do for him. I've never missed a day since, there, or elsewhere.

In parking we got a 30 minute lunch, unpaid, whether we took it or not.
If something happened we couldn't take a lunch, or had to work a little
over for some reason, we merely added that extra time to our lunches later on.

Yup; I've always done the same. I ensure that whatever I do or don't do,. I can explain in such a way to come out smelling like roses. But, of course -- they're paying for this!

We got no pay for over time in parking. It was a straight 37.5 hours a
week.

Essentially you were treated as being on salary. . .

If for some reason we didn't take a lunch we merely added that time to
lunch over the following days.

Quire fair & reasonable. & if the boss notices & whines, you just "work to rule" & take your mandated 30 minutes, eh, & he learns to leave you alone & trust you to get the job done, eh?

One time there was a power line down and had to secure an area until the electric company could repair the line and re-open the area. That was a 10 hour day, which gave me a three hours (all total) lunch which I took in
30-45 minute increments over a few

& why not? Some jobs, we'd just leave early, to use up our owed time, if the job was covered by as coworker, of course, or the work wasd one the same as if being there.

The reason was added to the time sheet and recorded on the daily.

on the clock, I don't care much what I'm doing. While others are still

training for one position, in 8-12 weeks, I'm prepared to be put anywhere in the company & do the job right, with no notice.)

Exactly how I've always been. If my payroll clock is ticking, I'm working, & I'm giving better value than I'm being paid for.

People should be trained for anything that might come up, or at least
have a book on how to handle something.

I make a point of knowing what to do in every area. With my current employer, I've had to run the entire international medical call centre by myself twice.

Here the courts have ruled that tickets given by private parking spaces are

not valid.
At Marshall all spaces were public.

In privately owned parking lots, I meant. Like Encorp has the contract with Richmond City to operate their lots on city property.

Without a specific bylaw, their tickets are only unenforceable requests (8but they can refuse you entry to all their lots if you don't pay)

I advise people who got them fair & square, to negotiate a flat fee to close out their file & regain parking privileges, if they feel they need them. (parking is at a premium in Vancouver downtown; if you arrive early enough, you can park all day for $8, otherwise you're looking at $8+ per hour!)

My boss' company was in a building that included a private lot. The landlord eventually went pay public parking there, but my boss, as a tenant, kept his space as included in the lease. Eventually, after 9/11 & theresulting slowdown in international travel, he sold his Mercedes sports car & used buses, to prove he wasn't taking any undue returns from our labours. I think he negotiated a discount on his lease to give up the parking space to the pat parking deal ($400/month for other tenants, almost dubler for outside users; a 1-BR apt was running around the same as the outside users wee paying to use one slot!)

There was no private or reserved spaces. The "reserved" spaces were for
the president and few others big shots. But even then the president didn't have one space, just whichever space was available in that area. But being creatures of habit, they were us

You expect the president & other higher ups to have priority in parking choices. . Usually they're marked, if set aside when the building was first built & the lot initially, or later re-, paved.

I enthusiastically supported this whole approach, as I'm all about fairness.

Yep. Gonna do it for one its done for all or its not done at all.

Yup. We're all considered equal under the law (in reality, we're all different, & some are "more equal than others," but at least when considering the laws &/or Constitution (just Big Daddy Laws, really.); thank goodness & God for that, I say! Arbitrary creation of laws & penalties("Off with his 'ead!" by individuals was never a good thing for all.

--- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
* Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)

CP wrote --

The way I see it -- if you hired the guy, presumably you have vetted him/her for the job already,

Yes and no.
The company I worked for (contracted to Marshall) did all the hiring and firing. I had little say in the matter other than a recommendation.
One captain I had would send just any warm body he had.
Doesn't work that way. He and my civilian boss went around and around
about this. She (and my) objections being he was sending "rejects" from another post.
The last captain I had was nearly as bad but would once in a while find
a fit.
The first hour of training I laid it on the table of what was expected
of the individual and if he/she wanted to go it. If not, no hard feelings. Generally they were told little to nothing of what was involved, just
"writing tickets".
I had a few who didn't last.
I had one who lasted about 10 minutes, another a few hours.
The few hour guy had been on the job about four hours. We spent a
couple of hours in training, broadly going over the job, then out ticketing.
There were two metered lots (I start people on them so they became
familiar with the writer mostly). I saw him on one lot across a narrow street and going about my business when he disappeared.
Looked all over for him, no answer on the radio.
Shortly after I was in the office and asked if they had seen so-and-so.
I was told he came in, put up his writer and radio and walked out. It was about lunch time and it was assumed he had gone to lunch.
Never saw him again.
The 10 minute guy was the shortest.
I had a new crew of three others just before the fall semester started.
We we seated around the table, introducing ourselves, etc.
The day shift commander of the police department walked in carrying a
clip board and asked each person their name. When he came to the third one he asked him to come with him. I thought nothing about it since the police department did background checks a
After several minutes and he was still gone we took a break until he returned.
Standing around outside we saw him "cuffed and stuffed" in the back of a patrol car as it was leaving.
Turned out the guy had five outstanding warrants on him from the state
of Ohio. He was taken to the regional jail and never saw him again.
(The company only did local wants and warrants, but the Marshall PD did national).
We would lose people all the time. A big turn over.
Partly it was due to weather (not like being out in the heat/cold, rain/snow, etc), grew bored with the job, found something better, etc.
I had a woman once who said the cold didn't bother her. She was on the
job several months and first cold day she never returned.
We had several who lasted for years.
Nobody beat my record of zero absences, zero sick days, zero call offs
and there for 15 years.

& no need to keep close tabs on them

I always had the problem of some people, once they found out someone
wasn't watching them every minute would start to goof off.
One time I had a fella who was coming in with 10-15 tickets a day when
that area produced 75-80 for me.
I spoke to him a while and he said there was nothing there.
He had just covered this one area and I went with him to go over it again
and pointed this permit was expired, that one was out of area, this, that
and the other violation. Once he found out that yes, I was keeping an eye on their work, they improved.

Of course; respect & common sense "CYA" self-preservation.

I used to joke a lot of what we did was CYA. :)

Of course, with an access card their comings & goings can be easily logged

And the cards only gave limited access for the most part.
A student needing to do something in a lab, tend to the lab rats, etc had access to the building and that lab only. Others had more access, some had full access.

plugs? Flash-drives? Under 1Gb each?

The first time they were 16b, the following year or two 32 was standard
and so on depending on the company giving them away.

This is how it is at flea market/bazaar type sales -- I ensure to do a go-round an hour before closing, to get steals

I haven't been to a flea market in years...
When I had a car I would stop by every so often.
That was where I got my IBM 286. The guy who sold it once worked for
IBM and refurbished them and gave a warranty with each one he sold.
That was sometime around 1994 or '95.

I was a smoker, so took 5 minute smoke breaks whenever

That was the way in parking.
There was no "it's 10 o'clock, break time".
I always told the guys they could take one any time they wanted, and especially after dealing with a difficult violator and had to keep their mouth shut. Take a break and let off the steam.

We got no pay for over time in parking. It was a straight 37.5 hours a week.

Essentially you were treated as being on salary. . .

Yes and no, since we took extra long lunches to make up any over time we worked.
On very rare occasions we would be paid a full 40 hours if we had to
work an extra long shift and that would be due to some emergency.
One time there was a big event and I made the mistake of going to see
what was going on and the chief (of police) "asked" me to stay and help out
the cops with traffic control. I didn't get away till 11.30 p.m., a 15 1/2 day. He authorised the extra time
But I made a mistake that day.
I had signed out and had the time sheet approved.
One of the rookie cops was filling out his time and asked another what
hours to put down and told to round it off to midnight.
I cheated myself out of a half hour. :(
I made up for it later on. :)
One time I had worked over and asked by a co-worker if I had ever made
that time up. I replied I had, several times over, and heard my civilian
boss laughing about that remark.

Quire fair & reasonable. & if the boss notices & whines, you just "work to rule" & take your mandated 30 minutes, eh, & he learns to leave you alone & trust you to get the job done, eh?

Never really had that problem.
Both my civilian and security bosses wanted to make sure we were paid
for that time. They merely charged it to the client. If the client
complained they were told why they were charged.

& why not? Some jobs, we'd just leave early, to use up our owed time,

I always told people in training we worked variable hours, the above
about working over and longer lunches.
There were also times, due to weather, we might get sent home early.
This was usually due to rainy days and can't write in the rain.
I never complained being sent home early. I always said the most
dangerous place to be in cases like that was between me and the door.
Now on other posts one had to be there regardless of the weather. And
stay until relived. They be told several hours before quitting time they
would have to pull a double, or they might learn minutes before they were to be relieved.
The worst part of the day for me was when my relief was due. Would they
be on time? Would they be early? Would I get a call I was working a
double.
It was a unwritten courtesy one's relief would should up 10-15 minutes early. This was to have any information relayed and the person leaving was able to go. This carried over to the next person. So one's hours would be 7.45 to 3.45, 3.35-11.45, etc. T
I had a few who would not arrive until 3.59.
Years ago I was working at a plant from 0430 t0 1730. The guy I
relieved at 0430 relieved me. I would arrive around 0415 and he flew out the door.
When time to relieve me he wouldn't show up until 17.29.59.

I make a point of knowing what to do in every area.

Each post is to have written post orders of duties to be carried out.
Some are warm a chair, others made regular rounds, etc.
Each are to have emergency phone numbers but some places didn't and some that had them were outdated.
I would mention to my captain that needed corrected and the usual
response was he would and seldom did.

Without a specific bylaw, their tickets are only unenforceable requests

Marshall's ticket are fully enforceable since a state institution.

You expect the president & other higher ups to have priority in parking choices. . Usually they're marked

There are simply signs reading "Reserved for the Office of the
President".
I do have to made one amendment to my "no reserved spaces" comment.
I had a private, reserved space. The only person on campus.
It was a wall in the office where I parked my bike. :)
Joe
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